Ahem ... I Am Not Pleased With John Murtha And His Allegations.
As our longtime readers know, I defend our troops. They need it here at home, and they deserve it for the sacrifices they make. To see anyone slandering the good name of the United States military makes me, well, surly; if I may use one of Thomas' words.
John Murtha the United States Marines have committed a massacre.
A war crime ... killed innocent civilians--knowingly and willingly.
Rep. John Murtha, an influential Pennsylvania lawmaker and outspoken critic of the war in Iraq, said today Marines had “killed innocent civilians in cold blood” after allegedly responding to a roadside bomb ambush that killed a Marine during a patrol in Haditha, Iraq, Nov. 19.
The incident is still under investigation by the Naval Criminal Investigative Service and Multi-National Forces Iraq.
The Marine Corps originally claimed that a convoy from the Camp Pendleton, Calif.-based Kilo Company, 3rd Battalion, 1st Marines, hit a roadside bomb that killed Lance Cpl. Miguel Terrazas, 20, of El Paso, Texas, and the ensuing firefight killed 15 Iraqi civilians — casualties the Corps at first claimed were killed in the bomb blast — including seven women and three children.
A March 27 Time magazine report published claims by an Iraqi civil rights group that the Marines barged into houses near the bomb strike, throwing grenades and shooting civilians as they cowered in fear. The report prompted calls for a Pentagon probe.
“It’s much worse than was reported in Time magazine,” Murtha, a Democrat, former Marine colonel and Vietnam war veteran, told reporters on Capitol Hill.
“There was no firefight. There was no [bomb] that killed those innocent people,” Murtha explained, adding there were “about twice as many” Iraqis killed than Time had reported.
No official investigation report has been released by the Pentagon and a spokesman for Murtha was unable to add to the congressman’s remarks.
“I do not know where Rep. Murtha is obtaining is information,” said Lt. Col. Sean Gibson, a spokesman for Marine Corps Forces Central Command in Tampa, Fla. “Thoroughness will drive the investigation.”
Three Marine officers from the battalion that is under investigation, including battalion commander Lt. Col. Jeffrey Chessani, were relieved April 7 for “lack of confidence in their leadership abilities stemming from their performance during a recent deployment to Iraq.” Officials would not tie those firings to the Haditha investigation, however. The two other Marines who were relieved, Capts. Luke McConnell and James Kimber, were company commanders within the battalion.
Murtha said combat stress prompted the Marines’ alleged rampage.
“It’s a very serious incident, unfortunately. It shows the tremendous pressure that these guys are under every day when they’re out in combat,” he said. “One man was killed with an [improvised explosive device] and after that they actually went into the houses and killed women and children.”
I sure would like to know who Representative Murtha's sources are, as well. And in typical fashion, Chris Matthews refused to demand confirmation from Representative Murtha:
MATTHEWS: Draw us a picture of what happened in Haditha.
MURTHA: Well I'll tell you exactly what happened. One Marine was killed and the Marines just said we're gonna take care...we don't know who the enemy is, the pressure was too much on them, so they went into houses and actually killed civilians and...I...
MATTHEWS: Was this My Lai? When you say cold blood Congressman, a lot of people think you're basically saying you've got some civilians sitting in a room or out in a field and they're executed on purpose...
MURTHA: That's exactly what happened.
MATTHEWS: ...not because any of the Marines are scared or anybody is scared...
MURTHA: ...this was not an action...this was not...first they tried to say it was an IED, there was no IED involved in this. This was troops, they were so stressed out, they went into houses and killed children, women and children. 24 people they killed. Now this is the kind of stress they are under. Listen, I don't excuse it, but I understand what's happening and the responsibility goes right to the top. This is something that should not have happened, that should have been investigated, they've already relieved three commanding officers...but this is the kind of stuff...stress is going to cause these kind of things. That's why I'm so upset about it.
MATTHEWS: Congressman, I just want to read something from the Marine Corps and then you can continue. The Marine Corps told us today that they're not going to comment today because the investigation is still ongoing. So they're investigating...
Anyone notice the first thing about this exchange? Stress? Please ... As my brother does serve in this war, he has confided in me many of his feelings. He is under stress, but he also manages to keep his head. And I would say that a majority--99% of our military--can do precisely the same thing. Do we have a few bad apples? Sure. We had the prosecutions surrounding Abu Ghraib (of which I know Thomas and I were vehemently oppsed to) and investigations of all sorts over the slightest allegation. So, to say this may not have happened is foolish. However, John Murtha should be held to account if the allegations are not even close to what he has said. I do not buy the "stress" angle, and it sounds more like trying to back one's own arguments up that are feeble and faulty, at best, to begin with.
As yet there are no court-martials. There are no convictions. Murtha's allegations are unfounded, at this point.
If this happened (and I do not believe that it has happened as John Murtha has proclaimed it to be) then obviously there should be prosecutions. The military is well aware of the Rules Of Engagement, and that no civilian is EVER considered a target until they make themselves one. Despite what the Left may offer up, in terms of an excuse, our soldiers are not stupid, or truly subject to emotion. Their training technically forbids it. As I said, the majority of soldiers will not engage in such behavior.
Hugh spoke with a retired JAG officer tonight who brought up one interesting point about this whole situation. With Murtha stepping forward to make his claims, he has virtually assured that these soldiers, if legal proceedings actually begin, will never receive a fair trial. He has already tipped the balance in the favor of conviction.
Way to go, congressman. Thanks to this bloviating outburst, if these soldiers are innocent you have already sold them down the river in the public's eyes. And that starts with the military "public" and ends with the civilian "public." Juries are still gleaned from among the peers of the accused.
MilBlogs DB has all the current, relevant information.
I am sickened by these unfounded charges. Representative Murtha has, once again, dishonored himself, his state, the United States, and the United States Marines. I doubt the Marines have a medal for such a long-slung slug like Representative Murtha is.
The Bunny ;)
As our longtime readers know, I defend our troops. They need it here at home, and they deserve it for the sacrifices they make. To see anyone slandering the good name of the United States military makes me, well, surly; if I may use one of Thomas' words.
John Murtha the United States Marines have committed a massacre.
A war crime ... killed innocent civilians--knowingly and willingly.
Rep. John Murtha, an influential Pennsylvania lawmaker and outspoken critic of the war in Iraq, said today Marines had “killed innocent civilians in cold blood” after allegedly responding to a roadside bomb ambush that killed a Marine during a patrol in Haditha, Iraq, Nov. 19.
The incident is still under investigation by the Naval Criminal Investigative Service and Multi-National Forces Iraq.
The Marine Corps originally claimed that a convoy from the Camp Pendleton, Calif.-based Kilo Company, 3rd Battalion, 1st Marines, hit a roadside bomb that killed Lance Cpl. Miguel Terrazas, 20, of El Paso, Texas, and the ensuing firefight killed 15 Iraqi civilians — casualties the Corps at first claimed were killed in the bomb blast — including seven women and three children.
A March 27 Time magazine report published claims by an Iraqi civil rights group that the Marines barged into houses near the bomb strike, throwing grenades and shooting civilians as they cowered in fear. The report prompted calls for a Pentagon probe.
“It’s much worse than was reported in Time magazine,” Murtha, a Democrat, former Marine colonel and Vietnam war veteran, told reporters on Capitol Hill.
“There was no firefight. There was no [bomb] that killed those innocent people,” Murtha explained, adding there were “about twice as many” Iraqis killed than Time had reported.
No official investigation report has been released by the Pentagon and a spokesman for Murtha was unable to add to the congressman’s remarks.
“I do not know where Rep. Murtha is obtaining is information,” said Lt. Col. Sean Gibson, a spokesman for Marine Corps Forces Central Command in Tampa, Fla. “Thoroughness will drive the investigation.”
Three Marine officers from the battalion that is under investigation, including battalion commander Lt. Col. Jeffrey Chessani, were relieved April 7 for “lack of confidence in their leadership abilities stemming from their performance during a recent deployment to Iraq.” Officials would not tie those firings to the Haditha investigation, however. The two other Marines who were relieved, Capts. Luke McConnell and James Kimber, were company commanders within the battalion.
Murtha said combat stress prompted the Marines’ alleged rampage.
“It’s a very serious incident, unfortunately. It shows the tremendous pressure that these guys are under every day when they’re out in combat,” he said. “One man was killed with an [improvised explosive device] and after that they actually went into the houses and killed women and children.”
I sure would like to know who Representative Murtha's sources are, as well. And in typical fashion, Chris Matthews refused to demand confirmation from Representative Murtha:
MATTHEWS: Draw us a picture of what happened in Haditha.
MURTHA: Well I'll tell you exactly what happened. One Marine was killed and the Marines just said we're gonna take care...we don't know who the enemy is, the pressure was too much on them, so they went into houses and actually killed civilians and...I...
MATTHEWS: Was this My Lai? When you say cold blood Congressman, a lot of people think you're basically saying you've got some civilians sitting in a room or out in a field and they're executed on purpose...
MURTHA: That's exactly what happened.
MATTHEWS: ...not because any of the Marines are scared or anybody is scared...
MURTHA: ...this was not an action...this was not...first they tried to say it was an IED, there was no IED involved in this. This was troops, they were so stressed out, they went into houses and killed children, women and children. 24 people they killed. Now this is the kind of stress they are under. Listen, I don't excuse it, but I understand what's happening and the responsibility goes right to the top. This is something that should not have happened, that should have been investigated, they've already relieved three commanding officers...but this is the kind of stuff...stress is going to cause these kind of things. That's why I'm so upset about it.
MATTHEWS: Congressman, I just want to read something from the Marine Corps and then you can continue. The Marine Corps told us today that they're not going to comment today because the investigation is still ongoing. So they're investigating...
Anyone notice the first thing about this exchange? Stress? Please ... As my brother does serve in this war, he has confided in me many of his feelings. He is under stress, but he also manages to keep his head. And I would say that a majority--99% of our military--can do precisely the same thing. Do we have a few bad apples? Sure. We had the prosecutions surrounding Abu Ghraib (of which I know Thomas and I were vehemently oppsed to) and investigations of all sorts over the slightest allegation. So, to say this may not have happened is foolish. However, John Murtha should be held to account if the allegations are not even close to what he has said. I do not buy the "stress" angle, and it sounds more like trying to back one's own arguments up that are feeble and faulty, at best, to begin with.
As yet there are no court-martials. There are no convictions. Murtha's allegations are unfounded, at this point.
If this happened (and I do not believe that it has happened as John Murtha has proclaimed it to be) then obviously there should be prosecutions. The military is well aware of the Rules Of Engagement, and that no civilian is EVER considered a target until they make themselves one. Despite what the Left may offer up, in terms of an excuse, our soldiers are not stupid, or truly subject to emotion. Their training technically forbids it. As I said, the majority of soldiers will not engage in such behavior.
Hugh spoke with a retired JAG officer tonight who brought up one interesting point about this whole situation. With Murtha stepping forward to make his claims, he has virtually assured that these soldiers, if legal proceedings actually begin, will never receive a fair trial. He has already tipped the balance in the favor of conviction.
Way to go, congressman. Thanks to this bloviating outburst, if these soldiers are innocent you have already sold them down the river in the public's eyes. And that starts with the military "public" and ends with the civilian "public." Juries are still gleaned from among the peers of the accused.
MilBlogs DB has all the current, relevant information.
I am sickened by these unfounded charges. Representative Murtha has, once again, dishonored himself, his state, the United States, and the United States Marines. I doubt the Marines have a medal for such a long-slung slug like Representative Murtha is.
The Bunny ;)
posted by Syd And Vaughn | 8:56 PM
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